Episode Transcript
[00:00:01] Speaker A: Welcome to now. No opportunity wasted. A podcast and a movement focused on making the most out of life's challenges and opportunities right now. Today, right now, I am sitting with author and just business, you know, star Andre Perry, author of the book know youre price. And what is the subtitle to the book, Andre?
[00:00:28] Speaker B: Yeah, know your price. Valuing black lives and property in America's Black City.
[00:00:33] Speaker A: Yes. And you know, I really loved stumbling across you and your work. I have a friend named Andre Perry who is a photographer. He's a black photographer who has made his pathway out of making images of happy black people. When the market said that you need to, you know, learn to shoot white people, he made a career out of it and now is the most sought after photographer in that lane. So as I was doing research for him, I. So as I was stumbling across research, I found you and your work, and I figured, you know what? We have to absolutely have a conversation as I started reading your story.
First of all, wow. This podcast is about how everyday people, whether you're famous or not, approach the challenges and the opportunities in their life. And as I started reading your book, I mean, right out the gate, you are talking about just growing up in challenge, like you were adopted, yet maybe still within a certain parameter of your family, and then also having, like, conflict in your home of people, maybe feeling like you don't belong. You know, find a, finding a place that you belong. How did you, and I know that you said even as a child, you kind of overcame some things to be able to not snap on people from the sort of the trauma of things. So how did you navigate your childhood and that and come out of that space of your adolescence into, like, was that very rough for you? Like, how was that navigating?
[00:02:16] Speaker B: Well, Angelica? Well, first of all, thanks for having me on this wonderful podcast. And yeah, there was certainly a lot of challenges as I was growing up, but my whole perspective is that my upbringing, my family are assets. They add value to my life and to others. You know, certainly I face a lot of challenges. But the theme of my book, know your price, and the theme of my work is to recognize the assets in black communities, the strengths, the jobs, the homes, the families that add value to people's lives but are not recognized. Well, as the story was told to me, before I was born, an older woman by the name of Elsie Boyd, I call her mom, made a deal with my maternal grandmother that she, that my mother would give me up to mom to raise in this small black majority city called Wilkinsburg, which is a small city surrounded by Pittsburgh. Now, at the time, my mother was very low income. She was young. She was 17, Orlando, 17 when she had me, 15 when she had my older brother.
There's a lot going on in her life. My father was a heroin addict. Eventually, my father would be murdered in prison. He was in and out of prison, but he was eventually murdered in prison. But mom did what a lot of black matriarchs did at the time. She took in kids, and I came along, my brother came along.
She watched between anywhere from twelve to 15 kids, between me arriving at birth and me graduating from high school.
What's interesting is so many of my siblings, biological, non biological, are doing well.
And I just talk a lot about how my story really contradicts what I'm told about black women.
[00:04:32] Speaker A: That's why I was so. That's why I was so. Because the narrative is always, like, when you start out the gate in situations where it's challenging, where people are having challenges sometimes. Either that's an excuse for people that this was my upbringing and this is. So I'm headed in this way, or people seem to underestimate people who come from a challenging background.
[00:04:56] Speaker B: Yeah. You know, so much of my training, I learned there's this classic report called the Moynihan Report, which essentially blamed black women for the state of black America. They said if black women only get married and exhibited certain behaviors, the black community would not be as in dire straits as we are. But the reality is that we would not be where we were if it were not for black women. And certainly I would not be where I am. But we're also just missing the many assets, the many strengths, the many solutions that black families overall create to combat the racism that we deal with every day.
[00:05:49] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:05:50] Speaker B: So, for me, I've always said that we need to see the assets, the strengths in our upbringing, not at a set of deficits.
[00:06:00] Speaker A: That is not a common perspective. That's not a common view.
You know, as a buddhist, we basically. They say, congratulations. Whenever you're faced with a huge challenge or whatever, they'd be like, congratulations. And after a while, you're like, it's kind of annoying sometimes, but it's just like, it gets us in this condition or this mindset to understand that everything in our lives can be turned into value. And we even have the saying, like, turning pain into medicine and turning that very thing that you thought was your challenge into your. And I feel like by looking at your career now and, you know, reading the type of work that you've done. It seems like, like you said, like your upbringing has very uniquely informed how you see not only the world, but maybe even just your purpose, or I would say, as well as the opportunity of our culture to create a new system of valuation. When it comes to black lives, I get, you know, I mean, I say lives as a general thing, but you're talking property. You're talking property value. You're talking to about all of these things in layers. What are some of the things that you, are you seeing improvements when it comes to that valuation?
[00:07:24] Speaker B: Yeah. So there's two aspects of my life. I really take my personal story and apply it to my professional life. One, in general, I look at black people, white people, Latinx, anyone in my contact, brothers and sisters. I grew up with people who were not my genetic relatives, but they were my brothers and sisters nonetheless. And I've learned how we have an obligation to our brothers and sisters, whether or not they share a mother or father or not. So for me, there's that critical aspect, but also I also apply my upbringing to my economic development work. A lot of people know me through my studies on housing. In 2018, my colleagues and I, Jonathan Rothwell and David Harshberger, did a study where we compared homes in black neighborhoods where the share of the population is. Black population is 50% or higher to those where the share of the black population is less than a percent. And we compared the list price, what you see listed on whatever zillow or other listing you have, and what we found, that without attending to crime, education, and other variables, on average, homes in black neighborhoods are priced about half as much as homes in white neighborhoods. Now, a lot of people will say that's because of education, that's because of crime. But those are things you can control for in a study, meaning we can get apples to apples comparison between similar homes in similar circumstances. So we put those controls down. And what we found is that after controlling for education, crime, walkability, all those fancy zillow metrics, that homes in black neighborhoods are still underpriced by 23%, about 48,000 per home. Cumulatively, there's about 156 billion in lost equity in black neighborhoods.
And I just want to put that in perspective. Because we throw out numbers.
[00:09:42] Speaker A: No, please do. Because that was a big old number to me.
[00:09:45] Speaker B: Yeah, but 156 billion is equivalent to 4 million black owned businesses based upon the average amount black people use to start their firms. It would have paid for more than 8,000,004 year degrees based upon the average amount or the average cost of a public four year education. It would have replaced the pipes in Flint, Michigan, 3000 times over. It's more than double of the annual economic burden of the opioid crisis. And it would have covered nearly all of Hurricane Katrina damage. 156 billion is a big number. And this is why I always say that there's nothing wrong with black people that ending racism can't solve. When things go wrong in black communities, we blame black people. We don't look at the practices and policies that extract wealth and opportunity, that every day without anyone wearing a white hood, without anyone carrying a tiki torch, this money is extracted. It is the money we use to lift ourselves up by our proverbial bootstraps.
[00:10:54] Speaker A: Well, let me.
Well, let me ask you this, because even saying that. Okay, because I want to tie something together as well. Like, you're talking about residential real estate, correct? Or are you talking about, like, kind of all of it? A little bit, I guess, in general.
[00:11:08] Speaker B: To come residential in that regard.
[00:11:09] Speaker A: Residential. But like, when it comes to commercial real estate, in those spaces, like I heard you mention, like in the book, in a book to which you nailed it on the head, where it was like, you know, just seeing this sort of like, same offerings of liquor store chiropractor, you know, what have you, and also having these food deserts, but then having a beauty supply store that is not owned by our own folks and how it's, you know, I've heard other folks talk about how it's easier to get those type of loans.
You know, it's easier. They'll offer us, like, credit card debt or all kind of other things. But when it comes to, like, loans for businesses and loans for different things like that, it's a little harder for black folks to get those loans in our own neighborhoods. Why? Can you speak or is there, what do you, what is your perspective on the fact that even in those neighborhoods you're speaking of and all that lost revenue and things that we can't tap into, how is that, like, compounded or affected by us not being entrepreneurs, I guess, in our own neighborhoods?
[00:12:24] Speaker B: Yeah. A lot of people forget that most people start their businesses using the equity in their home. So if we have low home ownership and we're not getting value on our home, we're not going to have the resources to start our business. In addition, commercial property ownership is wanting. Only 3% of all commercial real estate is owned by black people. Only 3%. So if you go down any commercial corridor in any neighborhood, more than likely we're not owning those businesses, which means it's going to be harder for us to operate in those facilities because the landlord can essentially charge rent at whatever rate, and it's going to cut into your profits. And so for us, it's imperative that we figure out ways to own not only residential property, but also commercial real estate as well. And one of the chapters in my book is, chapter buy back the block. How we can figure out ways to buy the facility so we can determine the kinds of businesses that land in those places. It's not a coincidence that we can make money off of these industries that sort of prey on our vulnerabilities.
I'm always seeing celebrities and others have alcohol deals and other things, and that's fine. I'm not going to hate on that. But ultimately, we need other forms of businesses that uplift black communities, that bring in revenue while not suppressing our overall development.
And so for me, we gotta figure out ways to own real estate, to own businesses that are going to advance our community overall and just create a new vision of who we can be moving forward.
[00:14:32] Speaker A: So what is that? What does that vision look like? What are some ways that you say, what are some ways that we can think outside the box and do that? Now? One of the things that comes to mind for me is shared economics. And, you know, I feel like many people in my community, and when I say my community, I'm now speaking to all the intersections of being black, being a woman, and also being of the LGBT community.
It is even with LGBTQ people, I find that sometimes we struggle to collaborate. And I feel like when we talk about shared economics, it's about a collaboration. It's about collaborative economics.
I think about shows like friends or living single. Let's get a good reference here, like living single, you know, and you've got these grown adults living in an apartment together, and, you know, they're not married, they're single, obviously. And I think that sometimes I always felt like the why of that was never really discussed or the why of what. I mean, obviously, they're in a big city, and so maybe that's why they were doing that. But I have actually been able to kind of come up in life by having roommates. You know, by. And I don't mean roommates, you know, I like to live at a certain level. You know, the apartment comes with a dishwasher, maybe a washer and dryer inside the apartment, what have you. So I might be paying a little bit more for my share, but I'm still sharing economics so that I can live at a standard and a level that helps me go out into the world and reflect how I feel, you know, in the world. So that's one of the ways that I feel like we could, if we could collaborate and do shared economics. But is that even a possibility, a reality? What are some ways that you might see that we might reach that vision you're talking about?
[00:16:38] Speaker B: Well, there are many different new emerging models of ownership that folks need to learn about.
There's this idea of community land trusts, where one, multiple people can actually own shares of property in an area and also own the property and not necessarily the land it's on. So it'll enable more people to actually own a home. Now, a lot of people will say, well, you won't get the same kind of wealth building from that because you're owning a facility cooperatively. But the reality is that if folks can stabilize their home, then they can get wealth in many other areas. And so for me, it is about figuring out ways where we can work cooperatively to own land, to own property, to develop businesses.
And in many ways, we have no choice. But also, I just want to be clear that in the age of Amazon and sort of global markets, we absolutely still need to have products that generate revenue from other communities, that we need to develop businesses where people of all persuasions can actually buy.
[00:18:06] Speaker A: Absolutely.
[00:18:07] Speaker B: We should not, if you are a black entrepreneur, that you should not just expect someone with your skin tone to only buy your products. In fact, it may not be sustainable in that way. So we need to also see ourselves as part of a global economy as well. And this is where I'm very passionate about expanding the share of employer firms, meaning firms with more than one employee.
Right now, the black population is about 14%, but the share of employer firms is only 2%.
If the share of the black of employer firms matched the black population, we would have 800,000 more firms in the country. We have millions of more employees.
And the reason why I bring that up, we need to get into industries that require 5000 employees, 10,000 employees. Oftentimes we talk about starting businesses, starting that coffee shop, starting the hair salon.
And these are great businesses. We know how to do it. But we also need to buy healthcare facilities. We need medical practices and hospitals.
We need utility firms.
So we also just need to scale up the level of businesses that we participate in if we're going to really participate in a global market.
So I say buy back the block. But let me be clear that we need to participate in markets that go well beyond our block. Yeah, well beyond our country if we're going to reap the kind of wealth we deserve.
[00:20:10] Speaker A: That's what I like about.
There's an Instagram account or a social media account I follow called we buy black. I think it is. And they highlight all these different things. And what I love is seeing black people who are selling detergent or toothpaste, you know, the things that everybody needs.
[00:20:31] Speaker B: Everybody needs.
[00:20:33] Speaker A: And I hear what you're saying, because a lot of times we do, you know, I don't know that line of basically having that pride in being a black entrepreneur and saying, this is a black owned product, you know, versus marketing and branding, something that speaks to folks even outside of your community. That sounds like. I mean, it sounds. I think it is challenging. Obviously, we have black business owners all over the country. I mean, I'm very inspired by a lot of the stories that I hear of entrepreneurship coming from black folks. But when you have states in states like Georgia, where I own my home in the state of Georgia and Decatur, um, I kind of feel like Georgia. And I have to choose my words lightly because, you know, I have lots of relationships in Georgia, and I love Georgia. I absolutely love Georgia. But I feel like sometimes the.
The tone I'm getting from black celebrities and folks that own homes there because, you know, there's. It has been very affordable to own homes in the suburbs and things like that. So I feel like there's this kind of 40 acres and a mule kind of mindset in Georgia where it's like, I have arrived and I'm successful because I have this land.
And yet they're still on fragile ground in Georgia because of policies, you know, when it comes to being able to run a business, even things like, one of the main things that I want to hopefully champion in Georgia is the legalization and the, like, sort of commercialization of marijuana and ways that are restorative justice into those who have been incarcerated due to those practices and giving them the grants first to sort of open up the dispensaries with all of the money that is in Atlanta as our black Hollywood, as we would call it.
I just imagine us being able to.
The brands that Snoop Dogg and all these rappers are creating for white Hollywood, as I guess they would, if that's black Hollywood, that we could be able to create those types of things in our own community, in spaces where you are, like in Washington.
Washington. Correct. Area.
Like, I know that they started to. I know they. They have dispensaries there now, right?
[00:23:27] Speaker B: Yes, they just started.
[00:23:29] Speaker A: Do you have any insight into basically, how that development is affecting sort of blacks neighborhoods.
[00:23:40] Speaker B: No, I'm not up to speed on the numbers, particularly in Maryland, because it's really nascent industry here.
But I will say this, that there are places where black business ownership is in general, is faring better than others. Now, you mentioned Washington, DC, metro area, the DMV, as we call it, Atlanta. These are generally considered like the Black beach chocolate cities. Yeah, right. Exactly. And we are, in general, doing better in certain areas of the world.
And I don't want to ever discount that, because when you look at even just basic life expectancy, there's places in where I live where life expectancy is. It's close to 80, well above national averages, is fairly doing well in the Atlanta metro area.
And part of when you look at the predictors of life expectancy, you see housing, you see business ownership, you see income. And all those things are doing better in some of our chocolate cities than in others. And so we certainly have an opportunity to take advantage of the assets in certain cities to grow and to influence policy in ways that can further our development as a people. And we should also have those places where life expectancy is close to 65 and lower in some cases, to learn from the places where black folks are doing better, because we should assume that black people are doing better in some areas because of our civic action, because of the things that we're doing. And we just need to do more of that. Because you are absolutely right, because the black wealth, the black white wealth divide is one where white families have about eight times the wealth of black families. Even when you think you're doing well.
[00:25:56] Speaker A: Exactly.
[00:25:57] Speaker B: You know, a family member goes to jail, a roof collapses, someone goes to college, and then you're tapping into your 401k, you spend your savings.
Our wealth profiles are very fragile. And so for us, we do need to think about how can we gain power in the areas in which we have strengthen to make sure that we can take risk starting businesses, that when there's a new policy on cannabis, that we can actually take advantage of it. And so we just need that formal political and economic power in order to make, to strengthen our status and to reduce our fragility.
[00:26:52] Speaker A: Yeah. You know, I want to say, first of all, just thank you for doing the work that you're doing, because I always say that everyone has something that kind of draws them and pulls them.
Doing that kind of data and research doesn't necessarily pull me, you know what I mean? So I'm interested. Obviously, we're all interested in the thing, but everyone we need people in all these different positions that have that thing, that inkling to do that work. I believe that data, and obviously, in the time of technology, the way the Internet and social media works, data is way more important than what I think a lot of people understand, especially because we're not so careful with protecting our data, with the ways in which we share our data, as well as not even understanding the value on our data. Some of our even lived experiences means dollars for nonprofits and things like that, you know? So having all of this data at our hands, having people like Alicia Garza over at black Futures lab collecting data on our people across the country, what do you see, like, as the vision of. Because I kind of feel like the next level is doing some, like, Wakanda likes stuff where we're able to capture that data and then send our resources into the spaces that need. Not only that need the help. It's not even about that need the help where the opportunity is at, you know, so that black dollars end up when instead of gentrification happening and white people coming in and buying up black neighborhoods, that somehow we communicate that vitality in that neighborhood to our networks that are able to jump in beforehand. I mean, is it something like that? Is it more? What else could you see? How do we get to that vision?
[00:28:51] Speaker B: Well, I will say this. Why I'm appreciative of being on this podcast is because we do need to uplift our researchers and our policy analysts and folks are doing statistics and qualitative and quantitative work because there are black people doing it. We are there, and it takes people.
[00:29:14] Speaker A: And we need you all there because other folks are going to read that data. Wrong.
[00:29:19] Speaker B: Exactly. We talk a lot about discrimination in policing and housing, but another form of discrimination we seldom talk about is access to data.
And so we need the stewards of data. People who can dispense it, can analyze it, can share it in real terms, real people, plain time.
[00:29:42] Speaker A: Make it plain.
[00:29:44] Speaker B: Make it plain.
And people who come from the lived experiences that we generally share. And so, for me, it is about getting on the podcast, getting in some of your more popular venues, so that people can see, hey, I grew up in very similar circumstances.
I see how you see. I'm just using tools to explain our stories in ways that can influence policy. And so for me, that's why I'm just very appreciative of people like you lending their imprimatur, their stage, their platforms, to say, hey, here's another aspect of our community we need to pay attention to.
[00:30:33] Speaker A: Well, I'm telling you the reason why I'm doing this. And, you know, with no opportunity wasted, my hope, my purpose, my intention in all of this comes from my buddhist practice. It comes from the space where I have learned that I am supposed to acknowledge all the value in all the people. I'm supposed to also reflect for folks that no matter where you come from, what your circumstances are, that you, too, can access or reach a level, enlightenment, wisdom, clarity about your life to help you make certain moves.
And it's so important because, you know, basically, as Buddhism, we believe the cycle of birth and death, you know, like, you're being reborn and things like that. And what we believe is, like, someone like myself is choosing to come back yet again and again and again so that I can show you. Okay, let me show you with one leg. Let me show you as a black trans immigrant. Let me show you in this form, because right now we have a world full of folks who have been tricked out of their value. And, like, the Bible will talk about, like, the devil's greatest trick really is tricking people out of that inherent value. So it is really important for me to use this platform to showcase folks like yourself who have been through some things, who, you know. Yeah, go ahead.
[00:32:13] Speaker B: I will say that I'm glad you brought this up because we will present ourselves in many different forms.
I just want to be clear to those listening, you have value in whatever form you're in. And it's part of our life's mission to recognize our value, because people take great lengths to sort of either mute the value they have or try to achieve some value that's very ephemeral, that'll go away, that these are not who you are. These things are not.
[00:32:56] Speaker A: It only has value in the moment.
[00:32:58] Speaker B: That's exactly right.
We're always in a state of becoming. But at some point, you need to figure out who you are because there's value there. You know, there is value there. And, you know, I like to think I'm handsome. I like to think I you is and all these things. But there's something deeper. There's something deeper in who you are. And if you can tap into those, that essence of who you are, then the sooner you'll get to where you want to go, ultimately. And so for me, I think we do a lot of gymnastics trying to figure out these very ephemeral, these very superficial things about who we are. You know, I'm more. I'm much more interested in sharing to our community that you have value, that you've come from different circumstances and you still have value, in fact, that sometimes you need to embrace where you've come from in order to see your value. So for me, that's part I measure homes and businesses. But the reality is, from my research, I see it, that our homes are much more valuable than they are priced, and we are much more valuable than we are than your price.
[00:34:29] Speaker A: Oh, that is a connection and a word. And you are yours. You are just.
And, you know, I think you're.
I feel, and again, this is, I try to be very careful about what I'm saying so that people know that I am never in a space of blaming anyone for their circumstances and being in places that they are in. But what I know is that from the time that we're born, people are pouring things into our brains, you know, pouring things into whether, oh, you're, you're too dark or you're whatever these things that we're picking up. And over time, some of us are exhibiting that we do not value ourselves.
[00:35:13] Speaker B: That's right.
[00:35:14] Speaker A: And we do not value each other. And, you know, I hate when something racist happens and, you know, or shooting of this and that. And then they want to, like, point, use that moment to point over to, well, y'all not doing this in your own community about these things or what have you. Like, I want to make it clear we, first of all, we can do two things at one time. Right now, we talk about this incident. Right now we talk about this white person going into this church and shooting up things.
But when we step aside and leave that conversation, I, you know, there are a lot of, like, there are not nonprofits in Chicago that fight gun violence and that have after school programs for boys and girls. And yet you'll have a celebrity like Ice Cube who will take an invitation to the White House and talk about how to solve the problems or whatever from very, like, conservative talking points, but has not actually talked to the organizations in those local spaces and the ones that they have, I've spoken to some of the people who have spoken to them, and they're like, they weren't even interested in the actual work. You know, it was just like an egotistical thing. So, like, you're saying the work that you're doing, the work that I'm doing.
Sure. I'm going to use my power to still fight the good fight out there. You know, there's some things I'm going to do in my life to kind of, like, enter certain spaces and arenas and, and make sure that we are represented and heard in certain spaces. But majority of my intention is about understanding, making people in my own community understand that we are so much more powerful than that mountain that looks so big, or that challenge that looks so great, that if we actually focus on our own value and increasing that value, and not only increasing that value, increasing our responsibility as a black community, as people like black men being responsible to black women, each the ones they're not sleeping with. You know what I mean? All black women.
[00:37:26] Speaker B: That's right.
[00:37:26] Speaker A: About black women being responsible to black men. About black men and women being responsible to black children. And what I mean by that is being able to respond.
Having the ability to have the right response to one another. A loving response, a caring response, a compassionate response, so that when we, as black folks, have folks in our family that are struggling with mental health issues, or that are born with a disability, or are deaf or blind or trans or anything else, what I know about coming up in a black family is my father used to have this conversation with me that said, you already have one strike against you in this world being black. And then he would tell me, you got another strike against you being male. That was one of your pre trans. And, you know, so he was like, so you gotta go, you know? And I think that unfortunately, if you have a mental. If you have a mental health illness or a challenge you're dealing with, if you are disabled, if you are anything other than an able bodied, cis, heteronormative person, I think that our community struggles to see value in those people.
[00:38:43] Speaker B: Oh, absolutely. And, you know, there's something related to what you just said, how I try to get people to see that there's nothing wrong with us.
I often quote vietnamese philosopher thich Tak Nan, who recently died. TikTok nan, used to say, if you're growing ahead of lettuce and it's not growing, you never blame the lettuce. You look to see if it's getting rain water. You look to see if the soil's enriched. You look to see if it's getting sunlight. You never blame the lettuce.
When, you know, we gotta be careful to stop blaming people for not growing by ignoring these structural issues. What I try to do in my work is to get people to see that they have value by showing how these structures are limiting their growth.
And when I compel people, we compel people to see that there's more growth that can occur. If we address these structures, we'll be better off. And. But I am very clear, I don't. I do not hide away from the very internal battles that we are facing, that there are downstream effects to these structures. People are hurting each other every single day in many different. I'm not just talking about gun violence. There's hurt and pain throughout our community, and we have got to deal with that level of trauma in the downstream level, but we're never going to get there if we don't see that there's structures out there that is extracting value. That's telling us we're the were not worthy. And so for me, that's how I focus my attention to get people to see, oh, you know what? It wasn't supposed to be this way. That there are these structures in place that are trying to say I'm of less value at the end of the day.
[00:41:04] Speaker A: Thank you just so much again, for. For being here, for being here, for making it through your journey, specifically the way that you have, for changing the things that you felt you needed to change to become a better man and to respond better to the world.
We need more folks like yourself. So, again, that is why I am going to amplify your presence on this podcast.
Thank you just so much for doing this. Before we go, I want to ask you this.
What do you think is the greatest opportunity or the greatest challenge that we are facing today?
[00:41:53] Speaker B: Well, I'll stick a little bit to my research. I really believe in ownership of homes and businesses, not just from a simple wealth perspective.
For the descendants of the enslaved who were once owned, owning and controlling our communities means something different. It hits different, as the young people say, or they used to say, that we really need to engage in a conversation about ownership, and not in a very trite british model where, you know, if I own a home, I can control everything. It's more about from, like, a black power perspective of being self deterministic, being self reliant, seeing our collective value.
And so, for me, I want us to own. But there are true challenges to that. The lack of wealth, the lack of capital in our community really inhibits that kind of ownership. So we need to figure out ways to get the capital so that we can begin to organize ourselves for ownership.
[00:43:09] Speaker A: Amen on that. I will say that, Andre, I'm going to continue to follow you, to keep tabs with you, to kind of even check in and, you know, check in with you, because, you know, I believe in the mission. I'm totally sold. And I love that you're doing.
[00:43:25] Speaker B: You.
[00:43:25] Speaker A: You have the data, you're doing the research. So I just. I'm going to tap, tap you in the future just to continue to amplify the message, because I believe you are absolutely correct. We do need to focus on, again, even if we take the conversation outside of sort of like, a capitalistic lens of just saying we need to have ownership of our own communities. Like, I love when you said that, like, because I I definitely feel that there's so much about our communities that is siphoned out. You know, there's so much value taken out of our communities, and then when we try to access it ourselves, we're told it has no more value, you know? So from your lips to God's ears to the universe ears, we are going to increase our community's ability to own our own community.
Yes. Thank you so, so, so much, Andre. Where can people. Can people, where can they get your book? Follow you, find you.
[00:44:23] Speaker B: You can always get know your price. Valuing black lives and property in America's black city, wherever fine books are sold. And you can always reach out at Andreperyedu on all the social media platforms.
[00:44:36] Speaker A: Thank you so much. I have the physical copy and the audio audible. So, like, audible, let me tell you, you can. You can highlight in the physical copy and. But the audible, you can keep going back to in a really good way. So listen, however you need to access it. Come get this information. Come get this information from Andre. We'll be right back.
You nam, your naming.
