Some Major Mentorship with Janetta Johnson

[00:00:01] Speaker A: Welcome back to now. No opportunity wasted. I'm your host, Angelica Ross. So much is going on. Today is Monday again, September 23, and today's word is from Buddhism day by day, from nitrandaishonin himself and says, quote, now, if you wish to attain buddhahood, you only have to lower the banner of your arrogance, cast aside the staff of your anger, and devote yourself exclusively to the one vehicle of the Lotus Sutra. Worldly fame and profit are mere baubles of your present existence. And arrogance and prejudice are just ties that will fetter you in a next one. End quote. Well, I will say this about nature. Daishonin. One of my favorite things about him is that he never minces words. And yes, arrogance can certainly stand in the way of an opportunity for growth. Today's episode, you're going to be able to see a little bit of that growth in action as I show this interview that is actually from April. So from, you know, more towards the beginning of when I was starting the podcast earlier this year. Jeanetta Johnson is an activist and an advocate that I've known for several years. And she's just one of those people who is out here working tirelessly to advocate and, you know, really support trans people, especially those who have incarceration histories. Jeanetta and I talked about her work, and we reminisced about the days in her youth when she was taken in by the iconic miss major. Throughout this conversation. It's just so beautiful. And, you know, of course, I bring up a lot of buddhist things just organically. So instead of our buddhist breadcrumb for this episode, just soak up the buddhist lessons and gems that I drop all throughout this conversation. Take a listen. [00:01:59] Speaker B: You look gorgeous, Jeanetta. [00:02:02] Speaker C: Thank you. [00:02:05] Speaker B: My first question for you, Jenetta, is how are you right now? [00:02:12] Speaker C: How am I right now? I'm busy, but I am doing well. I feel like I have a lot of peace and joy and well rested. [00:02:29] Speaker B: That's a feat in this time right now to be well rested and balanced and busy. It's a lot going on in the world, and you are doing some amazing work. And you have been actually doing some amazing work for a really long time. I know we've crossed paths a couple times. I think maybe the last time I ran into you was with Miss major and I think precious. Brady Davis, Chicago. Yes. I can't remember what event that we were at, but I feel like in this movement, you know, we all kind of end up crossing paths at some point or another. As I was looking at your story, though, I'm thinking that we might have had some similar experiences. You know, you said you. You spent some time in south Florida. [00:03:22] Speaker C: Yeah, I'm born and raised in Tampa, Florida. I lived in Florida, in Tampa, Florida, and I moved to San Francisco in 1997. [00:03:30] Speaker B: So were you a part of the. I think you were part of us girls that time when, like, everybody had t's in their name at one point, you know, when it was like, the adult, like. So we had, like, AOL stuff, we had the street stuff, like. And I just remember so many of us, you know, when we talk about, like, the criminalization of sex work and all the things that we've. Many of us have experienced, you know, I just remember being in South Florida, and South Florida was, like, the place where the girls were. Tell me about, like, tell me about the glory, the heyday of South Florida. When. When, you know, just when the time was right for the girls, if it ever was right. I don't know. What. Was that your experience? [00:04:15] Speaker C: Yeah, I spent some time in Miami. I mean, excuse me, not Miami, but in Fort Lauderdale. And it was a very good and fun and interesting time. And I can't think of the name of the bar that's was. What is the name of the bar that was in there? The, like, the biggest. [00:04:31] Speaker B: No, chev, what was it? Yeah. Oh, you talking about the coliseum? Oh, in Fort Lauderdale? [00:04:38] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:04:38] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:04:39] Speaker C: Okay. [00:04:41] Speaker B: Probably in Wilton Manors. I can't think of the bar, but yeah. [00:04:44] Speaker C: Yeah, it was like, one of the largest clubs in Fort Lauderdale. And I think they had one in. In Tampa as well. [00:04:53] Speaker B: Yes. I can't remember now it's gonna. Now it's gonna haunt me until I remember what that was. But, like, you know, we didn't have a lot of protections as far as, like, policies were concerned. You know, a lot of people didn't know anything yet about pronouns. I don't think, you know, at that time or whatnot. So what do you think for someone that's been around for a while? What. What do you see? I guess. What are some of the differences you see between, like, now and then being trans? [00:05:26] Speaker C: Um, just a lot more opportunities and a lot more visibility towards different things. And sometimes it's a plus, and then sometimes it's a minus around the visibility because coming from that time, sometimes it was safer to just be the best you can to just be a black female. And then, you know, now it's. In some aspects, it's. It feels a little bit. Certain areas, it's a little bit safer to just be a trans person. You know what I mean? But a lot I know for me, yes. Because I know for me, a lot of times, especially back then, it was a lot safer to just try to pass along as a black female and not. But. [00:06:14] Speaker B: But also. But also, let's be real, too, though. There was. It was like the guys were looking for the girls, though, like, and knew where to find us. So, you know, it was. There was the one side of, like, yes, for safety in, like, I guess, everyday thing or whatever. But at the same time, you know, the experience I had coming up was I didn't need to trick any dude, you know, about me being trans were places for us to find each other. [00:06:45] Speaker C: Yeah. But I mainly think about, particularly in certain areas or certain things we do in our everyday life, like going to the grocery store and just being in certain environments where, you know, it's. It's easier to just go get your groceries and come home and not. Yes. And not be sought out for any. [00:07:08] Speaker B: You know, I definitely get that. And you had an interesting experience. I don't know. Have you ever heard of Dream Hampton? Did a documentary called treasure. [00:07:19] Speaker C: I've heard of that documentary. I've seen that documentary. Yeah. [00:07:25] Speaker B: And, you know, one thing that I thought about that is just how easy it is for trans folks to get wrapped up in the system and. And just sometimes easily on some easy stuff. You know, she was smoking a blunt outside on the, you know, on her balcony, and then this cop kind of involves her in a situation, tells her to call her dealer, all kind of stuff that she doesn't even really get. And then now she's involved in a situation, and they end up, you know, basically getting her. Talk to me about how you made it out of a situation and then came out on the other side to serve the community. Cause there's other one other person I know, like you, like Dominique Morgane, who talks about, you know, her time being incarcerated and then came out swinging, like, you know, with community as far as, like, building their life and building opportunities for community. What was that like for you? [00:08:20] Speaker C: And yes, Florida was very much like that, especially in the early in the eighties and the mid to late nineties. And I had spent some time in a Florida prison. And during my process of being in that prison, I've learned that it's like I said to myself, sometimes it seems. I said to myself, it seems like you can come here inside this system, and you can do amazing things. Because the position that I held inside the institution as a person that is in prison was a very large position, and I was very highly complimented and recognized for. And it was pretty much working in the laundry and, you know, um, like, basically running the entire laundry room, um, and just making. [00:09:09] Speaker B: You're, like, doing management. [00:09:10] Speaker C: And pretty much the. The last time I got out, I just made a decision that I was gonna, like, create better opportunities for myself and figure out what my next move was. I no longer wanted to work the streets. I never no longer wanted to be on the streets. I just needed some time and space, and I needed to think and figure out how to pull myself out of those situations that I put myself in. And how did you do it? [00:09:38] Speaker B: I'm sure it was challenging. [00:09:39] Speaker C: Well, before I left, I went to every treatment program that I saw in the Tampa Bay area, and I was just like, hey, I need some help. I need some support, but this is who I am, and this is who needs to heal, you know? And they pretty much were like, oh, you're more than welcome to be here, but you're going to have to be that person and that person and that person. And I had knew somebody, and I had met some friends that knew Miss major, and they were like, oh, miss Major. There's a black trans woman that lives in San Francisco, and her name is Miss Major. And she. I know that she has a history of supporting trans people. And I had called Miss major. They gave me her phone number, and I was like, hey, my name is. And at that time, I was going by Jane Doe because I felt like if I didn't get the support that I needed to transition out of that stuff, I was like, my name is Jane, and I live in Tampa, and I need support. Somebody gave me your number, and they said, you help black trans women. And I was like, if I come to San Francisco, will you help me? And she was like, sure, baby. Sure, baby. And I showed up two weeks later with a suitcase and a carton of cigarettes and, like, $45. And I went to the organization that miss Major was working at, which was Tenderloin AIDS Resource center, also known as TARC. And during that time, Miss Major was a case manager. She was doing a lot of work supporting the trans community. And then they also had an office there that particularly the office where we held our transgender support groups. It was a very small office, and there was trans people. Just. The office was completely full. This was in 1997, and there were trans people all down the sidewalk waiting to get in to participate in this major support group. And Miss major. [00:11:49] Speaker B: Wow. [00:11:49] Speaker C: Yeah. Miss Major was our hope during that time. And when I got there, pretty much. I stuck with Miss major, and I'm not a very trusting person, but something inside of me, just, like, I trust this woman with my life. This is the last house on the block. That's a word that is used in different recovering settings around, like, this is your last chance to figure it out. And so I use the analogy that this was the last house on the block. If I didn't, like, cultivate a better quality of living and sustainability that keeps me safe, and not just keeps me safe, but so that I can also bring a whole bunch of other black trans women with me because, you know, just having an idea how a lot of us struggle, especially with substance abuse and substance abuse. And so I really took the opportunity to be very attentive and learn and grow from Miss major, and Miss Major is the one that politicized me. And. Yeah, and one of the biggest things that. I mean, there's so many things that Miss Major did that supported me in having this level of bravado when it comes to opening different opportunities for members of the trans community, because at this organization, Miss Major was working there, and we didn't have room for the support group. Like I said, people were lining up on the sidewalk trying to get into the group. And attached to that building, there was a door. But you know how the door is locked and you can't, like. Like a hotel where you have double a door to another room, and sometimes you can open it some. Well, they had a door like that, and it was closed, and we never gained access. But Miss Major had been asking the executive director at that time if they would please allow us to move in there and allow us to have that space for the transgender community. And so that, um. Because that was not enough space for us to meet where they had us at. And, um, Miss Major was asking and asking, and one day when the executive director went on vacation, Miss Major just showed up with these guys with a sledgehammer. And Miss Major, they were like, okay, Miss major, you got to take. They were like, we'll do it, but you got to take the first wing. And so Miss major got the sledgehammer, and she just made the first couple holes in there. And once the door was open, we went in there, and we cleaned that place out, and we decorated. It was just like Miss Major had furniture coming, cleaning supplies, and all the things, and we just moved in that building. And miss major's like, when the executive director comes back, he's probably going to fire me. So I need you to be nice. I need you to be sweet. I need to make sure that you're in this position so you can continue to do this work within this organization and within this capacity so that we still have access to this space and don't let them shut this space down. And so eventually, when the executive director came back, and eventually they did fire miss major. But she was okay with that. You know, she was okay with that because she had already planned and she had already prepped me to be there to make sure that we hold down the space. And the space was specifically for the trans community. And during that time, it was from nine to six, it was the trans community space. But after 06:00 p.m. we open it up to other community members, but it was our space, and we kept it up, so. And, wow. Yeah. [00:15:37] Speaker B: You know what that makes me think about is obviously Marsha and Sylvia and just how people don't really know, and they got a glimpse of it a little bit on pose as well, but people don't know how important these figures are. And these one girl, it's just like how much one girl can do, and it's so many of now us. One girl is kind of taking care of a couple girls or a few girls. You know, this podcast specifically is called no opportunity wasted. And, you know, I talk to people about how they've made the most out of life's opportunities and challenges and to me, because I want to talk to you about my experience. You know, I am going through some things, and I'm going to be going through some things where, you know, some data is going to be released and things like that, where, you know, with trans tech and, you know, the works that we've done and things like that. We've been work, doing a lot of work for ten years, you know, to do this work. And sometimes, you know, it is our sometimes it is the black trans women in our demographics and our data that are not completing, you know, the programs or the opportunities that we're providing sometimes, and I've experienced this whether it was my own organization or whether I was working at the Trans Life center in Chicago, like over a decade ago. You know, we would be offering certain things, and some took advantage of it and some didn't. Talk to me about who you felt like, who you needed to be. Cause you're talking about Miss Majors talking to you and saying, listen, I need you to be on your stuff and nice and what have you. Who did you have to be to take advantage of that exact opportunity that was happening? How did you have to show up. How did you show up? [00:17:57] Speaker C: Well, I think a large part of it is having the opportunity to really, really be mentored by Miss Major and having her really, really invest in me in a way. And a large part of it is sharing with her what things were important for me and also being able to take direction and leadership from her. And I know that I came here with a whole bunch of trauma in San Francisco in 1997. So, I mean, don't get me wrong, there were huge challenges for me to transition, but it's just, like, it was just very difficult embracing a lot of things. And I think about even a lot of the people that we work with is just, like, looking at different dynamics and different life experiences they had and why they are having such a difficult time accessing these things. And these are wonderful things that we're presenting them with wonderful opportunities. And it's just like. But I know that at one point in time, like, especially at the beginning of the pandemic, at the beginning of the pandemic, we went and got damn near every black and brown trans people off the streets, out of the alleys. I mean, we literally walked through alleyways and walked the streets. When the mayor said, everybody stay home. We mask up and gloved up. We went out and we brought our community in, and we had a large group of people. And I'm like, these people are moving, but these people are just staying in this turmoil, and they're keeping it, and they're having these, and they just feel like they couldn't get out. And then I'm very much a listener. I think that's one of the most important things that. And I listened to people's narratives, and I hear their stories, and I realized. And I started counting people, and I said, oh, these are, like, the 1715, 1617 people that told me that they have been through the foster care system. And I'm like, maybe that is why they are nothing flourishing and, you know, thriving in the way that a lot of our community members. And if you look at them, you know, don't get me wrong, a lot of people. A lot of our folks left home at, like, 17 or 18. [00:20:13] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:20:14] Speaker C: But it's a. It was a huge difference between the people were pretty much mostly raised by their parents and the people that were raised in the foster care system. But, you know, because we have opportunities and we present opportunities, I'm sure, you know, but sometimes people have these different things that, um, that life experience is different for them. And there's this different trust issues. There's too much not a lot that they can talk about without revisiting trauma. And. And it's just like, sometimes it's difficult work. [00:20:51] Speaker B: Yeah, it's, you know, it's just very. It's very difficult work. And it's, you know, it's. It's work that I know that, you know, I want us to get to these places, too, to, you know, as a buddhist, you know, and as a black trans woman as well, you know, I sit in these places that sometimes can be very awkward where it sounds like what I'm saying to folks is you can pull yourself up by your bootstrap because I did it, too, you know? And it's. That's not exactly what I'm saying. What I'm saying. What I try to at least position to folks is, I don't care what you're dealing with, what challenge. I don't judge anybody for anything, but the will. The will to want your environment to change, the will to want the change to happen has to come from within more than it is coming from without. And so I think that continuing to inspire our community, you know, what I mean to want to do, because now what I've seen through television and through some of these other things is that when people have seen me, like, acting on tv or singing, all of a sudden I'm seeing them. I'm seeing more trans girls singing a little ditty, you know what I'm saying? Or, you know, breaking. Trying to break into the, you know, the beauty industry and things like that, you know, but even still showing the folks that it's all, you know, disciplined, because I want to see, we know so many of our black trans folks are like, beauty. [00:22:32] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:22:32] Speaker B: And we, you know, talk about Kim Kardashian, talk about, you know, and even your gigi gorgeous, you know, who's been, you know, great doing the things that she's done on YouTube. You know, I've met a couple of our black, you know, sort of gigi gorgeous that could totally storm that area. And sometimes what I see, you know, the gap that I end up seeing is the process, you know, it's just like the. The business side of thing, because everything you do, no matter if it's an ice cream truck, you know, or a food truck, we got. We got Jada. I can't think of her last name. Out here in Atlanta, she has a soul food truck with her twin brother, a black trans woman. You know what I mean? So we are out here doing that business. How do you think? What does that love look like to both say I understand the challenges that you're going through and to give someone compassion, but what does the push also look like for you? Like, what does it look like to push our youth to have the courage and the strength to, like, do the work that they need to do to make their dreams come true? [00:23:44] Speaker C: Well, I know from my personal experience I had a small idea what life could look like for me, and that was when I was doing sex work in Fort Lauderdale. And that was, like, one of the first times that I got on an airplane and seeing people travel and just me, you know, actually booking a flight and traveling back and forth to Fort Lauderdale. But it wasn't until. And just. Just the small increments of even, like, being in prison and working in the laundry and, like, being, like, pretty much the manager of the entire laundry. And I'm like, you know, I think a lot of it has to do with people don't know what life could look like for them outside of trauma and abuse and hurt and pain and shame. And until some people. I mean, I feel like when I moved to San Francisco, I moved in with some people that were very life affirming that I was able to talk to, and I would share different things. I mean, I can remember I had got my first job working with Miss major at the center that she was at. And I can remember when I was catching a bus to go to work, and I would catch the bus to go to work, and you'd see all these family men taking their kids to the school and everything, but after they dropped their kids off, they would come back and try to pick me up, and I'm like, why are these guys. You know what I mean? And I was taking a pause because my whole life was by. About stop doing certain behaviors, because I want to see what life could be like for me without certain behaviors. And it takes a lot of work in order to. To do that. Or it actually even takes, like, who. Who thinks of, just take a break and see what life could be like for you without these things. You know what I'm saying? Take a break and see what it life is like without putting yourself in traumatizing situation. [00:25:46] Speaker B: Because I know that. I know the hard part. I feel like the hard part for the girls, too, sometimes. I know it was hard for me, too, was, why would I be dating these dudes who are lying to me, not offering me nothing? And I can sit here and get this dude to pay me 250 and call me back or whatever the situation is. So it's like. And when you see all these sides of men, like you said, you see them in their committed relationships, and then you see, as soon as the woman turned her back, yeah, they're over there doing something else. So it changes sometimes the way that we even think about what's possible for us, even relationships wise. But I think that you are correct. It's like, even still, it's. It's that radical part of believing that something else is possible for yourself. So how did you get to start working with the trans justice now? Let me. Is it the same as the transgender. The transgender justice funding project as well? [00:26:49] Speaker C: No, we're the transgender gender variant intersex justice justice project, and I will share with you, and I think that's the first time that I share it with anybody outside of our work. But we are in the process. We have changed our name to Miss Major Alexander L. Lee, TGIjp Black Trans Cultural center because, you know, we just recently bought a building in the city and county of San Francisco under. Wow. [00:27:25] Speaker B: And San Francisco is expensive. [00:27:27] Speaker C: And in 2016, after going through a bunch of trauma with gentrification and, you know, and just sharing spaces with people that would call the cops on our clients and stuff like that, because, you know, we too hoochie or whatever, people's interpretation of us, I made a commitment that black trans people were going to own something in this Bay Area because I felt like it's important for us to have black trans ownership. That, to me, I don't know. It just stuck with me. And part of it was because of miss major, because also, I think I was in my thirties still, and miss major was, like, 56, and she would really, really just be like, this is what we need to do, that we need this, and we need housing, and. [00:28:16] Speaker B: We need still planning. [00:28:19] Speaker C: And she would tell me these things as if. Though I was not that. As if, though she was not going to be here and she here. But it was important for us to create safe place for black trans people to be and not be interrupted by non black people. Like, having these judgments over how black people should act. And we're an organization that we don't call the police. We don't trust the police. We don't call the police for anything. We find alternatives to support our communities in difficult situations. And it was just important for black trans people to have ownership. And I look at non black LGBTQ centers that they get funding for black trans people, but they don't really serve us, you know? [00:29:11] Speaker B: Absolutely. You know, that has been that, you know, that is something that itches my tail I tell you, because I have just witnessed that firsthand for so many years, all these white led LGBTQ centers who are. And then you see them scrambling to put a black trans person somewhere so that they can get funding and say, see, we got a black trans person. We should get the funding. But that black trans person ain't got no decision making power. They are coordinators somewhere. If that are, like, an outreach person or, you know, what have you. So, you know, it's always been a situation where, whether it's been the medical industrial complex or whether it's been the nonprofit industrial complex where they've always wanted to put someone in between or appoint someone who's better than us to serve our communities, or they're not in. They're not even giving us pipelines, it sounds to me like. And which is so amazing to witness and hear that, like, Miss Major was creating her own little pipeline and saying, like, as I'm gonna do what I can do, but I need you to continue doing something. So let me build and pour into you, and then here you go, pouring into doing the same thing. So talk to me about, like, the services that and the things that you all do. [00:30:35] Speaker C: Well, at TGP, we serve and center black trans people. We provide a great deal of services, such as, we work with trans people in prison, getting out of prison at high risk. Particularly, we work with trans people that have been chronically homeless and trans people that have been impacted by incarceration, even if that means one of their parents were incarcerated or particularly. But we have our reentry social economic justice program, where we have a program. If trans people come out of prison, we provide them with an opportunity to work within our organization through our reentry department. And reentry must come with a paycheck. And that is my motto. Reentry must come with a paycheck. Who has time to go to a reentry program that does not come with a paycheck coming out of prison? [00:31:32] Speaker B: Hello. Yes, straight out of prison. Ain't nobody got time for that. [00:31:36] Speaker C: And then that's part of our socioeconomic justice program, where we also have various community members that are going through different experiences and stuff like that, and we're in a position to also hire them. And it's usually like a six months to a year program, and it also gives them an opportunity to present themselves and to see if they want to actually work for the organization, like, become a full time employee or they can find other employment opportunities. And it's just kind of like part of it was part of it was my own personal experience of being incarcerated and seeing trans people in and out of jail, like seven times within the 13 months that I was inside the jail. And also telling them different places that they can go for services and opportunities. But for some reason, that never happened. And I thought, oh, when I get out, I'm gonna go talk to Starbucks. I'm gonna talk to all these different companies, and I'm gonna demand they hire my community, da da da and respect their name. But, you know, and this was when I was inside, but by the time I got out, I'm like, I'm not going asking them for shit. We're going to create our own positions within our own organization. We were pretty much like short staff. So we created jobs within our organization that provides. Also provides leadership development and other opportunities. Like a lot of people that have had legal experiences in prison and worked as, you know, people that are in jail, lawyers and different stuff. So we created positions so that when they get out, they could work with the legal team. So they work with our attorney in positions as legal assistant and advise the attorney because, you know, a lot of information on the inside that they don't, you know, so they were like our inside people. And also we have an opportunity, like, to hire members of the community. And we're in the process right now of doing a freedom school. And this freedom school is pretty much for the people that I was just talking about, the, you know, 1517 people that were struggling. And it's like, I know that our therapist told me at one point in time, working with certain groups of people, it's going to take about four years to actually work with them and to see the change. And it's at that four year mark now because it's pretty much at that four year mark because we. Well, we've been working with them, but working with them in a different way where we're housing our clients because, you know, a lot of our clients struggled in shelters and they preferred to sleep on the streets. Then they're going side the shelter system. And I don't know if you know that here in San Francisco, they have what they call srosity, which are single room occupancy and also known as pissing the sink. Hotels where you have to go down the hallway to use the bathroom, so you just pee in the sink. And so we have been working over the years to no longer have our community members living under those conditions. So it's been the last two, almost three years that we have been doing a lot of advocacy work and getting our clients and our community members into apartments and, you know, just creating a different narrative and a different experience for them and trying to normalize trans people not being chronically homeless, trying to, you know, create a different narrative around trans people living in these disgusting hotels that. [00:35:29] Speaker B: Are so mean, because, to be honest, like, I. I feel like every city I travel to, I just see my girls. I see. And I see. And I am talking about the ones that are really struck a struggling. Like, how. And you could tell, like, they're on the streets and they're trying to figure it out on the streets, and you can tell with the shelters and things like that that are gendered and all these different things as it's. It's a difficult time. And it's just, you know, I feel like our society looks at our community and just sees someone that, like, is that they don't want to help, that it's almost like. And so when it. When you create an organization like this, it feels like. And even sometimes, you know, there's brave spaces in Chicago. There's, you know, there's obviously the work that we do as well in black and all that. But it's like, if. If it weren't for these organizations, like, if it weren't for miss major, if it weren't for Sylvia and them, like, nobody. And did the gag be the money that being gay Inc. That don't seem to trickle down, you know, to us? Um, what do you. You know, when. When we were all sounding the alarm before we have marriage equality passed, you know, and we were trying to get everybody to be on the same page and be like, we gotta get, you know, the equality act. We gotta get everything in so that trans people are good, too. And now, you know, we have seen less and less of the white gays, of lesbians, also white lesbians. You know, we've seen turf wars. You know, we've seen all of these things. And now we're in an election right now where, you know, it's funny, we have all these LGBTQ rights organizations, and I think that none of them really kind of had the crystal ball to see that so much focus would be on trans people, whether they want to now or not focus on it all, like, the anti laws that all of these things are against trans people, and yet you have all these organizations that aren't run, and here we are in an election season again. How do you feel about the state? You know, Biden has his state of the union, you know, address. What is Jeanetta's state of the union, you. What is the state of both the LGBTQ movement, but also intersectionally, because you are also a black woman, you know? So for you, what is the state of things, and how do you see us challenging the status quo moving forward? [00:38:19] Speaker C: Well, you know, I have really been interested in a lot of the things that are going with these laws and legislations and bans that they're putting on the trans community. And it. I mean, even to the effect of, I'm in Florida, where pretty much if your id does not match the part between your legs, it's just like waking up one day and be like, oh, my God, I'm from Tampa, Florida. I go there five, six times out of the year. I'm not safe anymore. You know, how is this going to impact me? How is this going to impact my travel and particularly living in San Francisco? I don't consider San Francisco a safe place, but I also figure that San Francisco might be a safer place for trans people to be. And my response to a lot of that is pretty much, like, keeping trans people safe. Keeping people safe, like, getting them into housing, providing them with, you know, different information and resources and freedom schools so they could fully participate. Supporting trans people coming out of prison by creating these jobs and actually hiring people while they're in prison. Like, when they go in front of the parole board, we give them a higher letter, and we're like, hey, this is your higher letter. So if you release someone on a Thursday or Friday, they can come to work at Tgijpenne that Monday, and we'll figure out a better position and a better opportunity and support them in transitioning back into society and getting them to be in a position to help us participate because, you know, a lot of us have been doing this work for years, and we are pushed in, and some, we're a little bit exhausted, so we need new bodies. And I. It's just like helping some of our community members heal. And, you know, I often. When I say recovery, I say discovery. And when I say discovery, it pretty much means, like, what life could look like for you. What changes do you need to make in your life so that you can feel safe, so you can feel present, so you can feel a little bit more available to support our community as a whole because we need people. And even to the extent where. And I believe in supporting people coming out of prison because I was actually hired by Miss major when I had a six and a half year sentence. I was going on my way to prison, and I spent 13 months in the jail. And miss major came to visit me, and she's like, I'm really disappointed about this current situation. And I realized that you just made a poor decision and you got into scarcity. But she was like, I was about. [00:41:18] Speaker B: To imagine that kind of grace being offered to more black trans women. [00:41:23] Speaker C: Yeah. And that's where we got the. That's where I got the ideology and the decision to create jobs for trans people coming out of prison, because Miss Major waited three and a half years. I had a six and a half year sentence, but Miss Major waited three and a half years for me to get out of prison so that I could lead the organization and become the executive director because. And pretty much I was raised by Miss Major. So we have a lot of the same understanding and compassion and how to serve community and how to care for community and how to support people in a way that makes them feel special. And one of the biggest things that I know for me that was very effective and impactful is just that Miss Major spent a lot of time listening to me, a lot of time listening to me. So I was able to tell her everything that I needed to, like, release our every experience of trauma. And sometimes, you know, that is important and to get the empathy that you never really got in those experiences around, you know, some of the things that we experience in life. Which reminds me of a book that a particular author wrote yesterday. I cried. And. Yes, and I realized eventually, I did read that book, but I cried so much. You know, Miss Major got those big old titties, and I would just go and lay my head, even in her leadership with me. She's having me going to these domestic violence groups. She's having me going to all these different toxic shame meetings and just a lot of different things. And I would literally be. Because I'm very. I was very new in recovery and very new and transitioning in a different way of going to all these different groups. And I would just sit there and cry, and people would just come and just coddle me and coddle me. And they were like, oh, you can leave if you want. And I was like, no. Miss Major told me to come here. And I'm like, I'm here because I believe that if I'm here to learn something, I'm here to grow. And I would just sit there and just cry, cry, cry, cry, cry. You know? But, you know, it was just that determination to, like, just seeing that glimpse of hope, of coming to San Francisco and going to Macy's and seeing trans people working in Macy's and seeing trans people moving around in the city in different jobs and positions. So, you know, it was like having that glimmer of hope that life could be different from me, from my previous experience that kept me in incarceration when I lived in Florida. [00:44:14] Speaker B: So that's amazing. You know, you just obviously reminded me, too, just. Yeah. How important it is to be heard, you know, especially with the younger trans youth. And. And we, you know, they're good. All of it seems like something so small, but it can be just such a big thing to have somebody actually see you and hear you and listen to you and actually believe better for you, believe that there is more for you. How can people, you know, listening, you know, maybe they're not trans. Maybe they are part of the community. How can they support the mission that you are doing? How can they support your organization? [00:45:03] Speaker C: Well, you know, there's different components, and I don't know if you've ever heard, and maybe someday you'll come, but we have a national all black trans GNC non binary convening, which is called black girls rules. And that's just another thing that was manifested when I was in prison. I was like, when I get out, I'm going to change everything. It's going to be my rules. It's going to be like, I'm going to navigate this world where, you know, because sometimes we experience oppression in society and in the world, and it's just like reinventing. Reinventing yourself, being in community with other trans people, making sure that, you know, at least 1000 trans people, so that if you ever feel alone, you could always reach out to them. But we have our national convening called Black Girls Rules, which is an annual event. And I think this. This is the 7th year or the 8th year. [00:45:59] Speaker B: And when will it be? [00:46:00] Speaker C: In August in San Francisco? No, no, no. We always pick a different location. We've been many places. We've been to Florida, Colorado, Hawaii, generally Las Vegas. And it also, like, we also invite trans people that work at various nonprofit organizations because, you know, we don't get an opportunity to go out and enjoy ourselves and give people an opportunity to visit locations that they thought they would never have access to. And also for trans people coming directly out of prison, especially people that have spent a long time in prison, we want to kind of show them what life could be like for them without, you know, participating at things that keeps us in these systems of oppression and just kind of model. And, I mean, it's great to be in a room full of trans people that are all working or have their own business and, you know, doing different work in the community. And a lot of people are just like, oh, okay, this is how we live now, you know, versus how we lived 20 years ago or 15 years ago when they came out of prison. So that's BGR, our national all black trans convening, which is also known as black girls rules. And so now we're working on developing a freedom school. And the freedom school is particularly for the community members that live in this community. I mean, pretty much it's like we share narratives of different people when we're asking for different access to things. And I, and we at TJP want to make sure that we create an opportunity and invest in people in a way for their growth and for their healing and for their opportunity to feel educated in some ways and empowered in some ways, to, like, feel stronger, and also to prepare them to take on some of the positions within the organization, because this is 10,000 sqft organization. The building that we just bought in San Francisco at 131 Franklin street in Hays Valley. [00:48:24] Speaker B: But congratulations also. [00:48:27] Speaker C: Just. [00:48:28] Speaker B: That's amazing. [00:48:28] Speaker C: Yeah. And in the freedom school, we're also going to pay the participants to be a part of the freedom school. And because we have like 120 trans people that are being housed through our subsidies program, we're gonna just create and we pay a percentage of their rent, so we're gonna pay them to participate in the freedom school. And it's. [00:48:56] Speaker B: That's a, that's a, that's a heck of a, you know, start. You know what I mean? Like a new start. You know that for. Cause I, you know, I've always been the kind of girl like, give me a corner. Yeah, give me a corner and a warm something, and I'm gonna come right back to that corner each day better. You know what I mean? Just give me a little corner and I'm gonna make it work, you know, and I want to figure out. So I have something that I'm launching, you know, both with the podcast. You know, we call our listeners winners. And basically it's because with no opportunity wasted. This concept comes from my buddhist sort of faith and whatnot. And we basically believe that every moment of life is a chance to sort of win or lose, you know, so it's, you can lose one battle, but you can keep going and still be so a winner and having a winning mindset. So we have this sort of winner circle with our 1 second. Sorry, I got my dog on me. Off go. Sorry. She usually is. She just knows that I've been on the podcast for a minute. She's like, mom, are you coming? I'm gonna be there in a minute. Just hold on. So, you know. Yeah. So we call our listeners winners. It's because I also want to get everybody in the mindset of knowing that no matter what the situation is, you can create a life that you deem to be valuable and to be a winning life, and you can keep, you know, just as long as you never give up. And so part of what I'm doing as well is creating this kind of community of folks, and most folks will be able to pay for it. It's different membership levels from $4.99 a month. One is $19.99 a month, and another is $39.99 a month. But it's basically different levels of engagement. Being able to be in a private zoom with me once a month in our winner's circle to talk about, basically, what are we trying to overcome? What challenge are we trying to win at? And then them being able to have access to a breakout moment with me to get specific guidance on that. And then the next level, they get access to that weekly. So some get. Get to come to the monthly thing where everybody's in there, and then a smaller group, I guess, that are paying for that. They get to come in weekly and have this time with me to both feed off the synergy of winning, but also get guidance from me in that space. What I found is that, you know, we have trans tech, and we have opportunities with trans tech for folks to get into tech. A lot of my trans girls and trans folks or whatever, and they, you know, there's the tech, but they might not be interested in coding or doing those things, whatever, and they want to do other things, whatever that is. I don't really even care. I know that I can. I am here to motivate and inspire folks to win. And there, you know, I have my buddhist friends, and we share that free because we all have the same books that we're learning from, so we can all do that, but not everybody's going to learn those things. But there's so many great, reasonable, like, character building things about having the right spirit and energy. So I built this whole program and what have you, and I'm thinking, let's talk. You know, let's keep talking in the sense, because I would love to be able to maybe create a. A specific lane for folks that are coming out of, like the folks that you're specifically working with to get them into that winning mindset as well off the bat to be like, you know, we talking to Angelica Ross and she says that we could do whatever we want to do as long as we follow these, you know, these four basic things. And some of the basic things that I'm giving people is really a great abstract acronym. I'm sorry. 1 second. Candy. No, stop. You getting me down? Yes. My Doberman's name is Candy. Down. Stay. And so I would love to be able to do that as my sort of, like, we'll figure it out and how many people and how many we can handle or what. But I'd love to especially have it be separate, too, because they are dealing with a different space. And I wouldn't. I mean, it would be great to have them in the, you know, the rest with everyone else. But I also want to make sure they feel protected and feel, you know, in a space where they're understood and not being judged and things like that, but same programming. But just to those who you feel would be accountable to showing up for some, for an opportunity like that. I would love to offer that to the people you're working with. [00:53:39] Speaker C: Oh, that would be great. And I could think of a particular audience that you just. You just sharing that with them and spending that time with them and, you know, believing them in a way and inspiring them that they have an opportunity to shift things to where they feel more sustained in life. Because I always want to make sure that people, you know, create a sustainability in their hearts and their mind and their spirit. And I think that a large part of our community. I don't know if you know Aya Simone, right? [00:54:17] Speaker B: Yes, of course I do. [00:54:19] Speaker C: But, you know, she. We bought her to quite a few of our BGR's, and the girls were so amazed to see a black trans. [00:54:30] Speaker B: Woman play the harp. [00:54:32] Speaker C: I mean, to the point where they were, like, bowing down to her and I. And she really, really, like, boosts people's feeling about who they are, you know what I'm saying? Because she showed them what. What life could be like for them if they. [00:54:51] Speaker B: And it's so what I love about Aya, too, is that, like, it's so specific in the sense of, like, playing the harp. Not many people do that. Not. Not many cisgender people do that. So for her to be doing that, it's such a example of, you can do anything, girl. Whatever you want to do, whatever you're willing to put your work behind, you can do it. [00:55:14] Speaker C: But. [00:55:14] Speaker B: And I definitely want to be a part of that mode, you know, because really, for me, right now, I'm in a place right now where, honestly, I have been struggling with how I engage because some girls have treated me like a trick. You know what I mean? In the sense of, like, you know. You know, some girls have treated me like a trick, and I have failed for it every time, you know? But. But I also. I understand the importance of this work, but I also understand sort of, you know, the importance of a person needing to want to be accountable to. To a process, you know, to something. So even if I can monthly start, you know, like a monthly meeting and that, again, once a month, that they can do that. But again, I'm trying to get to a space where I am working with folks weekly. So if I can create a lane weekly that check in, I will. We don't think about and talk about it with all the things, but also because these are the things that. What folks don't even understand is, I'm sure you probably go through some of the similar things, but a lot. So much of the work that we do goes unfunded or underfund. [00:56:31] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:56:32] Speaker B: You know, so. So folks can donate. They can go. What's your website that folks can go to? [00:56:37] Speaker C: People can go to tgp.org and just go to our website and there's a link for them to donate. [00:56:46] Speaker B: So please, those of you listening and those of you that can please donate to this amazing work that is being done, you know, because it's not that many people who have the heart of. And that was one thing, too. When I passed off the baton to EC Pizarro III to be the executive director at Trans Tech, like, it took a minute because I was like, I needed to one make sure I found somebody who had the heart to serve our community, who could serve our community even when sometimes maybe they didn't show up in certain ways and wouldn't judge them and turn them away and all that kind of stuff or whatever. So the fact that he is taking that on so well with that we're talking about some things, and we'll see what's going on. That my next chapter is to motivate the girls beyond tech and just, you know, and just outside of their own box, whatever box they may be in. But just to kind of, you know, because we've been kept out a lot of spiritual spaces. So literally, what I'm trying to do is bring the sermon into, like, a layman space. You know, that's not dogmatic. That's not anything but telling people, because one of the things in the program that I'm going to introduce the folks to is four pillars having a spiritual foundation. And I tell folks, I don't care what it is. I just need you to know that inside your body, you have something that performs like a battery. And sometimes it's low, and sometimes it's fully charged. Sometimes the energy is negative, sometimes it's a positive charge. But I want you to have some kind of practice and conversation with being able to have a conversation with that energy within you. A practice. Buddhism, Hinduism, Judaism, witchcraft, whatever works for you, sweetie. And then understanding, we go to the second thing, which is intrinsic value or inherent value. And this is something to work with people. And this is something sometimes as a challenge for folks. Cause it's a rule that says you must understand that you have value built in, and not only are you valuable just at go, but so is everybody else. So you need to walk through life in a way, in a respectful way that respects the fact that you have value. And no matter what it might look like for somebody else and not judging them, they also have value. Very simple principles. And I go deeper into these things, and the l is for life condition and understanding. They can go from a high, low life condition to a high life condition. And then the last one is curate your curriculum. And I tell folks that, listen, I don't have a degree to my name. I don't have a bachelor's degree. I don't have. Listen, I did graduate high school, and I do have some college under my belt, but what I know is that those degrees aren't necessary. What is necessary that is that you value education and that you just find your own way to curate your learning. You might not need calculus. That might not be a part of your curriculum. You know, it might be sales and communications. It might be some other things. So talking to them in these frameworks, that's outside of spaces that feel so oppressive and dogmatic, I think, is going to be the key to putting a, you know, lighting a fire in some of the folks and knowing that they actually can do the things that they want to do. [01:00:09] Speaker C: And, you know, Miss Major has been offered many, many, many honorary degrees from many, many colleges across the United States. And she's like, you know, I'm. [01:00:21] Speaker B: I don't. [01:00:21] Speaker C: I don't want them. And the reason she didn't want them is because she. She said directly she want to make sure that her girls understood that whether you got one or not, you still have an opportunity to be who you want to be. You know what I mean? And I was like, I was like, mom, you better get that degree. Like she's like, nope. She's like, cuz I want. Right? [01:00:45] Speaker B: But you know what she is. Listen, one thing I know about Miss Major, the one thing I know that has been very consistent is Miss major stands on business. Miss Major stands on business. And like, that's such a. And I get it. I like, so I'm getting goosebumps because I kind of just jail with that attitude because that's where I'm at. Like now, mind you, if they offer me one, I might. I might accept the degree. I might. Miss major, don't judge me, too. I might. I might accept it. But I'm still moving right now without a degree and show, and moving in a way to show my, my brothers and sisters that it is not necessary that you. That you can have a valuable life without that. And you can determine because, baby, I make a low down check and ain't got a single designation degree behind my. Matter of fact, they actually teach about me in some college courses. [01:01:39] Speaker C: Yeah. [01:01:41] Speaker B: You know me. And they teach about Miss major, too. And I'm sure they'd be teaching about you. [01:01:44] Speaker C: Oh, yeah. I mean, Miss Major hire lawyers and within the organization, you know, hiring all these people and bringing these people in the organization that. But. And that's why we always try to create social economic justice program. So people get an opportunity to come inside the organization and be in organization and be trained in different departments. Because if you want to be a part of HR or operations or any department, you just. It's up to you to just build a relationship with the people that are in those positions. And a lot of times, we create positions so that people can get trained in different positions. And that's their job, is to be a part of the reentry case management services so they can learn how to. To provide those services for other people that have experienced some of the marginalization that we experience as transgender people. And so. [01:02:44] Speaker B: But let me ask you. Let me ask you this. Outside of TG, what is the acronym TG? [01:02:52] Speaker C: Tgijp. [01:02:54] Speaker B: Tgijp. Outside of TGIjpe, outside of all of this work that you have been doing for the community, what makes Jeanetta happy? What are some just, you know, outside of the work? Like, what are some just things that make you happy and goals that you would like to see for your own life? [01:03:29] Speaker C: Well, I know that I really, really love being an auntie to my nieces and nephews and to my little cousins that are growing up. And most of them, even though some of us, some of them were cousins. But because I'm an older person and they hear my nieces and nephew call me auntie, so they adopt the same language. But I think spending time with my family having Sunday dinners, because I come from a family that pretty much usually cooks every Sunday, like, a large meal and invite each other over. [01:04:07] Speaker B: What a blessing it is, right? [01:04:09] Speaker C: And just being with my. Being an auntie, like, I love being an auntie. I love celebrating different events with my family, like birthdays and stuff like that. That brings me joy. And that's something that I set the intentions to, like, really, really learning focus. It's not like I organically got that it was working with a coach and, like, what. What do you want? What is freedom, liberation, and joy, like, for you? And just over the years, just. I'm just. Just working on those things and, you know, growing up and finding these things and realize that they are very important. And I also enjoy traveling to certain locations that are where you want to go. [01:05:02] Speaker B: If you could go anywhere in the world, where would you be? [01:05:05] Speaker C: Okay, so. Well, we were having a conversation about different cosmetic things, but I know that today I. That wherever there's a place that I can go. Cause I have, like, my skin on my face is kinda, like, messed up. [01:05:20] Speaker B: Listen, baby, you ain't gotta explain nothing. Cause I'm a girl that's like, baby, if you wanna do it and got the coins to do it, like, wherever. [01:05:27] Speaker C: They'Re doing that, that's where I wanna go. Wherever they doing that, that's where I wanna go. [01:05:33] Speaker B: Absolutely. Hopefully it's somewhere where you can heal. [01:05:37] Speaker C: On a. Oh, yes, definitely. I love the beach. I love the water, and I'm born and raised in Florida, but. And I spend all my time in Florida with my family. I go very. I don't go anywhere without my siblings because I said, one day I'm gonna just take up. [01:05:52] Speaker B: That's a blessing. [01:05:53] Speaker C: I said, one day I'm just gonna go to Florida, and I'm gonna spend three days in Clearwater, on Clearwater beach. Because they have really nice hotels close to the water on Clearwater beach. And I said, I'm like, I'm not gonna let my family know that I'm there. I'm just gonna spend time in Clearwater on the beach, and just enjoy being on the beach, you know? [01:06:13] Speaker B: Well, I want that for you because I know how amazing that feeling is to, like, have a window open and just hear the water, you know, and be relaxing and not have anywhere to be. Not have no call phone calls or Zoom calls to do, you know, and just. And I really do believe that rest is our birthright, you know, and rest and joy and vacation and all of those things are ours to be had, too, not just the struggle. So I can't wait to see all of those things for you. Before we go, is there anything else you want to share with our listeners? Anything we didn't talk about? [01:06:52] Speaker C: Did we talk about the Capitol campaign? Like I shared, we just bought a building. We officially moved in in August. It took us about two and a half years to really get to a place. We were very fortunate that we had a donor who was really, really impressed with our work that we do in supporting trans people coming out of prison and the extra efforts that we go to to create safer spaces for them. So they donated $2 million. They took me to Amsterdam, and they were like, I need to talk to you. I want to take you to Amsterdam. And we spent three weeks in Amsterdam, and they said, in two years, I'm going to donate you guys $2 million to buy a building. Well, actually, they said they were going to buy a building for us, but when it came down, but they gave us $2 million and they wanted to buy us a building, but it was only 2000, was like, thank you, but we don't want to buy this building. We want to wait until we get. [01:07:54] Speaker B: Listen, I. This is what I love this. Listen, I love about the right girl. The right girl knows how to say, oh, that's cute. I was thinking about something else. You know what I mean? Because let me tell you, so often, we are just kind of. Of put into position where we're expected to just accept whatever's being offered to us. But the fact that you are dreaming bigger and got bigger, girl, congratulations. Congratulations. I definitely. I definitely. I'm so glad, too, that we got a chance to talk. And because I know we've seen each other, bumped into each other, you know, but I haven't really got a chance to really connect. And now that we're, like, really got a chance to connect and know the work that you're doing, let's continue to talk. Cause I would love to have some of your folks become a part of my winner's circle and get them in the winter minor. [01:08:47] Speaker C: Okay. Beautiful. And I love the work that you do in tech as well. I think that's so important and so vital. It's a little bit over my head, but I said something. [01:08:55] Speaker B: Well, let me tell you, it is not over, because I'm gonna tell you we do have a program. And one thing to let your folks know, I'm gonna be working on something. And definitely your folks could do it, too, because if they can do HR and things like that, that cybersecurity, there's a lot of job openings in cybersecurity, and it's not coding. It's. It's, like, logistics and guidelines and protocol. You know, it's that kind of stuff. It was so. It's very easy. But it's. It's high paying. Very high pay. Like six, you know, very high paying is very easy. So I'm working with a black trans man as well, too. He's doing a training for cybersecurity and to make it free to folks as well. So, like, I'll follow up with you on that. But cybersecurity is where it's at, girl. It's not even, like, Cody. It's not even, like, hard. [01:09:43] Speaker C: It's like, it's always good to have another skill in your belt, too. I mean, you know? [01:09:51] Speaker B: Absolutely. Yes. Absolutely. Listen, it's so. It's such a path that I'm taking. [01:09:56] Speaker C: Yeah. And a lot of times we talk about what happens if the movement in. Because this is a movement, not a momentous, but what are we going to do when we no longer, you know? So it's really great that those things are offered, and people have an opportunity to have secondary skills, and especially some of us that spent years working in the nonprofit complex. And I've been doing. I've been doing this work, I mean, officially on a job for 26 years in the city and county of San Francisco. And it's just like, what happens when everybody get free? Then what will I do next? You know? [01:10:38] Speaker B: So that's the time to imagine, you know, what I'm be doing. I'm be making music. I'm making music. Playing my pianos. Sing a shoe. Wapa doo wapa doo doo doo thank you. [01:10:49] Speaker C: Thank you so much for me. [01:10:52] Speaker B: Absolutely. Enjoy the rest of your week, and just thank you for the work that you're doing. [01:10:56] Speaker C: Keep doing, and thank you for the work that you're doing. And you're greatly appreciated. And I'm so happy that I had an opportunity to speak with you. I've listened to your podcast, and I'm like, this person is so, like, thank you so much. [01:11:10] Speaker B: And I'm trying to find that balance, too, because, you know, one thing that's great with our buddhist practice that I love is being a buddhist. We also can kind of be a little sassy. You know, it's just because there is not a lot of right and wrong, you know, it's just cause and effect. And so sometimes I just take that liberty to speak firmly about the things we need to speak firmly about, you know, because it's just kind of. It's kind of time. I'm no longer 19. I'm 43 years old, so it's. I'm taking on my auntie when it's time to talk to the. [01:11:41] Speaker C: Yeah. I have my own spiritual practice, and I often tell a lot of my community members, you better make sure you have a song in your heart, because when things get trouble, you need to be able to sing a verse or a chorus, you know? Yeah. You must keep, you know, something in your heart that's gonna sustain you during very difficult times, you know? [01:12:02] Speaker B: Absolutely. So we are on the same page. I say you have to have some kind of spiritual foundation. I don't care what it is. I'm not gonna force mine on you. Just make sure that it speaks to you. Yeah. Thank you so much, janetta. Take care. You holding me?